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Author Topic: Dark levels are unfair and too dark  (Read 9800 times)
Whooper1222
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« on: August 15, 2013, 04:00:14 AM »

I was having a good run. I got a boomerang from a gift box and made it all the way to level 2-4. Also got two consecutive Restless Dead level on 2-1 and 2-2. I could have made it to the Ice Caves easily, for the first time to the Ice Caves.

But damn, I got a dark level and juggling my boomerang and torch was extremely hard. Guess what, I died. If it hadn't been a dark level, I would have beaten it easily.

What a great run ruined by a dark level. Cry
Oh God Why?
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Stray Cat
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« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2013, 05:47:20 AM »

It's true that dark levels are harder, but with the gold you get from lighting wall torches and the scarabs flying around, they also provide an opportunity to earn much more money than ordinary levels.

Also, you know - You get to hear those awesome music tracks.
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Whooper1222
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« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2013, 08:15:51 AM »

It's true that dark levels are harder, but with the gold you get from lighting wall torches and the scarabs flying around, they also provide an opportunity to earn much more money than ordinary levels.

Also, you know - You get to hear those awesome music tracks.
Scarabs may be good in the Mines, but in the later areas is no good. You can't risk your life collecting them.
Money isn't worth if you die.
The problem isn't just dark levels, but the fact that you have juggle your torch and weapon.

Yeah, the dark level musics are awesome, but still not worth wasting a good run.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2013, 08:32:09 AM by Blaze06h » Logged

Ultimate117
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« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2013, 07:27:59 PM »

Throw the torch ahead of you and observe. Listen for noises, and what direction they're coming from. Move slowly. Don't waste your time finding the damsel.

They're quite doable.
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Whooper1222
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« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2013, 12:56:38 AM »

1) Throw the torch ahead of you and observe. Listen for noises, and what direction they're coming from. Move slowly.
2) Don't waste your time finding the damsel.

3) They're quite doable.
1) What if the torch falls on water? Not a good strategy anymore, is it? Because it did fall on water when I threw it in that run.
2) I wasn't finding damsels or trying to collect scarabs, I was just trying to complete the level with my boomerang.
3) I know they're doable, but unfair in respect to the difficulty difference between a normal level and dark one. Also, as I said before, I had juggle my boomerang with my torch, that's not easy, atleast for me.
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NalaNosivad
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« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2013, 04:23:41 PM »

I actually think you can re-light the torch on one of the wall torches you've already lit, though I haven't attempted it myself. Can be rather dangerous I imagine, of course.

My strategy in classic Spelunky was always:
Is this a dark level? If so, rush for exist ASAP

My strategy in the new Spelunky tends to be:
Is this a dark level? YES! MONEY! GOLD! JACKPOT!

I have no idea why my attitude changed, but they somehow seem more survivable in the HD/XBLA version. I think when it comes down to it, all that matters is knowing the "feel" of the area you're in to survive a dark level in that area.
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Whooper1222
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« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2013, 06:09:32 AM »

1) I actually think you can re-light the torch on one of the wall torches you've already lit, though I haven't attempted it myself. Can be rather dangerous I imagine, of course.

2) My strategy in classic Spelunky was always:
Is this a dark level? If so, rush for exist ASAP

My strategy in the new Spelunky tends to be:
Is this a dark level? YES! MONEY! GOLD! JACKPOT!

I have no idea why my attitude changed, but they somehow seem more survivable in the HD/XBLA version.

3) I think when it comes down to it, all that matters is knowing the "feel" of the area you're in to survive a dark level in that area.
1) What if I lose my torch? In a normal level, I don't have to care about a torch.

2)For me, it's quite the opposite, though. Don't know how you think it's more survivable in the HD version, where it's even darker and enemies like spider drop from nowhere.

3) It's a really good event/feeling but my logic here is, what if it was just a normal level instead of a dark, I could have survived it.
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Nathan
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« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2013, 10:43:21 AM »

Yes dark levels are harder but not unfair. If you use the torch properly you can breeze though them. And to your questions just don't lose the torch. Spelunky is a rogue like get used to it
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Whooper1222
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« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2013, 12:16:35 PM »

1) Yes dark levels are harder but not unfair.
2) If you use the torch properly you can breeze though them. And to your questions just don't lose the torch.
3) Spelunky is a rogue like get used to it.
1) You didn't get why I said it unfair. Just think, what if it were a normal level, I could've beated it easily.
2) It's not as easy to do as it is say. I can handle torch well, but handling a weapon like boomerang (which comes back when I throw) with it, forces me to throw the torch and take the risk of losing it.
3) I know, but can't we improve it, What's better, being a rogue-like or being great.
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Nathan
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« Reply #9 on: August 17, 2013, 08:31:37 PM »

Spelunky is random meaning you can get dark levels which are harder than normal levels. I'm sorry not every level is exactly the same. If you simply learn how to handle dark levels you will look forward to them instead of bitching about how they are unfair. Sorry if I am a bit harsh its just people complain about this everytime Spelunky is released for a new platform and they even complained about it when the original spelunky first came out.
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Harest
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« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2013, 02:51:43 AM »

I didn't get the activation mail in time in the night, so someone else said what i wanna said o/.
But, yeah : Random is part of rogue-like games, deal with it.

Whining about how dark levels which aren't normal levels will do nothing. They'll not make the game easier just for you. The actual games are already quite too easy.
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Whooper1222
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« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2013, 03:16:10 AM »

1) Spelunky is random meaning you can get dark levels which are harder than normal levels. I'm sorry not every level is exactly the same. If you simply learn how to handle dark levels you will look forward to them instead of bitching about how they are unfair. 2) Sorry if I am a bit harsh its just people complain about this everytime Spelunky is released for a new platform.
3) They even complained about it when the original spelunky first came out.
1) I'm not bitching about them, in fact, I like them than any other event. But I was extremely sad because a single dark level ruined my chance of visiting the Ice Caves for the very first time.
2) I know, I can't tolerate them either, I didn't meant to do the same. At that time I was a little annoyed at this, that's why I posted this up here. I'm not one of those people, if I had been one, I would've complained about the ghost being a timer and there's no point of playing the game when you keep restarting and have to start from scratch. I didn't posted here when the dark level occurred for the first time, but when it ruined a steady run where I could have completed the level easily if it had been a normal level.
3) I never complained about a dark level in the Classic version, they were much easier then those of the HD ones.

I didn't get the activation mail in time in the night, so someone else said what i wanna said o/.
But, yeah : Random is part of rogue-like games, deal with it.

Whining about how dark levels which aren't normal levels will do nothing. They'll not make the game easier just for you. The actual games are already quite too easy.
Did I complained about the randomness? I complained about the fairness.
If another player gets not a single dark level in his run, didn't it make the game easier for HIM?
If the last level had always been a dark level for everyone, I wouldn't have complained, because that's for everyone and is fair.
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Harest
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« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2013, 03:30:03 AM »

Did I complained about the randomness?
Yes you're. Because you find "unfair" the fact RNG didn't like you and put you a dark level.

I think you should learn the notion around random god. Random means you can get pretty fast awesome items, or not. It means you can get a dark level or not.

Seriously guy, your speech is pretty boring. I think we just should let your thread die, like you died in your dark level Tongue.

When you don't like RNG, just don't play a rogue-like which is the perfect genre where RNG is everywhere. You'll see "unfair" situations everywhere. Like the damsel is stuck behind walls, unreachable with your current items.
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KarjamP
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« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2013, 12:13:31 PM »

By the way, Nathan, Spelunky is technically NOT a roguelike.

It was inspired by them, though, hence the game's difficulty.
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Nathan
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« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2013, 01:18:28 PM »

By the way, Nathan, Spelunky is technically NOT a roguelike.

It was inspired by them, though, hence the game's difficulty.

.....
Derek himself considers it a rogue like platformer
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